SPEAKER_00 0:01

Welcome to What Would Amber Do with your host, Amber Howard, your weekly dose of guidance, inspiration, and strategies to have your small business and whole life thrive. We bring you incredible guests who share their real life experiences of being an entrepreneur so you can have your whole life work. Now, here's your host, Amber Howard.

SPEAKER_04 0:26

Welcome back, everyone, to What Would Amber Do? It is my honor this morning to be speaking with Michelle Baxo. Michelle is a mindset, love, life, and leadership coach who helps superwoman and people pleasers own their worth, navigate their complex lives, and fulfill on their dreams. Michelle is a published author of the book Power Love Dating and has been featured in Cosmo, Insider, and Forbes and many other major media outlets. Michelle is just so, and and as well, Michelle's a mom and a spouse, and like so many different things. And for me, who Michelle is, is she was my coach and you know, coached me with my leadership. And Michelle, you really are part of the reason why I am the woman I am today. So just thank you so much for being on the show and sharing yourself with us.

SPEAKER_03 1:14

Ah, you give me goosebumps and thank you so much for having me.

SPEAKER_04 1:17

Yeah, so good. So typically we start with like, how did you end up where you are today? And what that looks like today, for those of you who can't see, Michelle is in a beautifully manicured office, which looks lovely, with her delightful daughter busying herself and playing behind her chair. You know, this is what it looks like to be a, you know, to be a human being and have it all work. But how did you get here today, Michelle?

SPEAKER_03 1:39

Oh my gosh, that's a story that could probably last the entire show, but I won't, I won't, I won't have the whole show beep on how I got here. Um, so let's see, where is here? So here right now, um, I am living in a little town called Keswick, which is an uh an hour north of the city, we're right by the lake. And um again with my with my wonderful daughter, and I live with my my partner Tommy. And um and it's one of those dreams, and work I work for myself, I work from home, um, you know, make my own schedule and get to make a huge difference on the planet. So I really do feel like you know, uh very fortunate, very grateful. And I would say, probably in a nutshell, I'll go into more detail, but in a nutshell, how I ended up here is I've always related to everything as um a stepping stone to something else that's next that I don't know what it is. Um, so in some ways, I've been a bit of a gypsy in life. I've lived in all kinds of different places, I've been in all kinds of relationships, I've been single for huge chunks of time. I've dated men and women. I've, you know, like the whole, I'm a very like go out and experience life kind of person. And um, but always inside of anything is possible, anything can be created. Um and like my mom and I laugh about this all the time. They're like, oh yeah, like of course. I got, you know, of course, being a camp counselor for a number of years uh led me to um, you know, led me to teaching. Of course, teaching led me to wanting to um be a teacher of of life rather than of um, you know, curriculum. Of course, right, and getting, you know, and getting my uh so okay, so let me get a little more specific. So I was so I was a school teacher um and uh and uh kind of a different type of school teacher. I did teach humanities grade eight, but I also um taught environmental outdoor education. That was my first, my first degree was in environmental studies. And uh, but I didn't really want to work for the government in that way, like and I didn't want to be testing water, but I was very passionate about um, you know, us being stewards of this planet and taking care of this planet and taking care of each other as we know, like you know, having a future. And um, so I so I got into teachers college in this area of environmental outdoor education. It was awesome. I got the best job ever. There's can you see my daughter? I can she's adorable. Hi. Want to be on the show with us? Wanna be on the podcast? Okay, honey. You can you can watch okay, you do what you gotta do, honey. Um, and so so there I was, like living, you know, I was about 30 years old, like life felt it felt like things were being handed to me in a lot of ways. This great job, the best school with the most amazing principal who celebrated all of what I wanted. Okay, hold on one second, my darling.

SPEAKER_02 4:43

You want to pass me your iPod? Okay, come in. Or if you just push the button, I bet it'll work.

SPEAKER_04 4:49

This is part of it, right?

SPEAKER_02 4:51

And that it's part of it.

SPEAKER_04 4:52

I love it. It's funny because I'm sitting here, I'm like, do I take it out of the show? Do I leave it?

SPEAKER_03 4:57

I'm like, no, no, I almost want to leave it because this is like it's all fine. But this is part of it. Like everything that happens, we don't know. Everything that happens. Oh, oh, you know what it was? Honey, the password was was on. That's why. There you go. What do you say? Normally, thank you. Okay. Um so so there I was, about 30 years old. Everything seemed great, but I was also in a relationship, I should mention, with uh someone who had a severe drinking problem, um, who really kept trying to manage it or to overcome it. But, you know, it was the roller coaster of someone not really fully taking their sobriety on. And uh and someone very, someone very wise said to me, you know, Michelle, he doesn't have a drinking problem. You have a problem with his drinking. And I was like, oh, and because Amber and I have done similar training, like what I didn't know that was then was stop making him wrong and choose your own damn life. If it doesn't work for you the way he's living, then choose something else. If teaching sounds like this great thing, but isn't working for you, choose something else. And I kept not listening, I kept not listening, I kept breaking up, going back. I was saying I was gonna, you know, um leave. I was living in Calgary at the time. It uh awesome city just didn't feel like my home. I knew it wasn't where I was I knew it wasn't where I was meant to be, or that it was meant to be temporary. It was a lot of talk, very little action, and uh and then something pretty like random and awful happened to me. And I won't go into too much detail, but basically I had what we um a sexual predator that was stalking me and breaking into my home and doing strange things. And um, and and if I hadn't have left, um, it likely would have ended up being something very dangerous. It followed a particular pattern that detectives all know about, freaked the hell out of me, threw me into a PTSD, which doesn't normally happen because I was never, I was never raped by this person, like none of like I wasn't physically harmed. Um, but because of some of this other not listening to my intuition, not listening to my life, not like not just all of these like getting excited for and not taking a step forward created so much anxiety in me that this one thing happened, it threw me right out. And um, but it was also a gift, right? Gift from the universe saying, live your freaking life. So I took a three-month pause from my life, um, a leave of absence from my job, and um and it gave me a chance to be like, what do I really want to do? What do I really want? So I did a lot of healing. That's where I got, I started exploring um uh some well conventional conventional therapy, like cognitive behavioral therapy. I started learning um how acupuncture can actually help your brain. Um and then I also got into um like biofeedback. And I came across this. I when I eventually went back to work as a teacher, I had this amazing psychologist who also merged a lot of spiritual work. So that's where I started learning how to tap into my own intuition um through pendulum dowsing, through um like your own, like um sort of like um, sort of like dowsing with your own body. Uh, and then also uh a whole other modality blew my mind. I was like, oh my gosh, this is amazing. Um, taking traumas and other ones too, from this awful thing that happened to this thing that was a little bit further away. I'm like, okay, I always wanted this awful thing that happened to be, I didn't want it to be about getting better. I wanted it to be about like have this be a springboard for my life. So I'm like, all right, I'm ready. How do I have this be a springboard for my life? And she said, the landmark forum. And that's how Amber and I met, anyone who's listening. So I was like, oh my God, that's so funny. My mom talked for my entire teenage life about the landmark forum, and I never paid attention. I was like, landmark this, landmark that, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's how I was about it. And then here was this woman, and I was like, I want to springboard into my life. I don't know what I want. I don't think I should be teaching, but I don't know what it should be. She was like, just do it. And I was like, oh shit. I know if I do this, I'm not gonna go back to teaching. I know if I do this, I'm gonna move to Toronto. I know if I do this, I'm gonna heal my relationship with my dad. And that was terrible, all of those things were terrifying to me. And so I almost didn't do it, but I did. And um, I ended up actually doing the soonest one uh in a different province out in BC, out in Vancouver. And I really got that it was about choosing my life and trusting, actually discovering what self-trust really is. And you'll hear me say this all the time that self-trust is not about preventing mistakes, it's not about doing the right thing, it's about who we are for ourselves when things don't go the way as we planned, because it never does. It never does, no matter what. And I got, oh my gosh, really, no matter what, I could drop everything in my life, I could change anything, and I know I'll be okay. I know I'm a survivor, I know what I can do if I really like cut the bullshit and really go after my life. And so that's what started my entrepreneurial life was so I did. I I um I gave my notice. My principal was so supportive because she knew she knew I she knew that something was up and I needed to just go live my life. And she was like, Michelle, this never happens in the Calgary Board of Education, but I'll make damn sure if you ever want to come back, you can come back, but just go, go do it, live. And I was like, thank you so much for not making me feel like an asshole. Um, and uh and so and so so it began. I finally cut the cords of that relationship that I wasn't in anymore, but still kind of in, um, and started really living my life. So I went, I started, uh started my master's in counseling psychology. Um, and I was working um for Downsdue Park. So I was offering environmental education to kids, which I was good at. Obviously, I got hired to do it. I had tons of experience. You can see her again, she's gone pee. Um sorry, listeners, my daughters. You can see her behind me going in and out of the room. Um, so uh but it's so funny. The mom, right? Like the mom part of you, the minute you see the kid moving, you're like, where are they going?

SPEAKER_04 11:12

Are they?

SPEAKER_03 11:12

I know anyone who's not a mom listening is probably annoyed by it. Anyone who is a mom listening understands with the brain right now, right?

SPEAKER_04 11:18

It's just interesting that never goes away. So a couple of things are and I'd love to kind of hear you finish this, but a couple of things are really coming up for me. Like what and this has been coming up a lot. Like, I think I've shared this on a couple of shows recently. This idea from Soren Kierkegaard that it's in like we our life can only be understood looking backwards, but it has to be lived moving forward. And and so, like, I say, like, it's in the rear view mirror of our life that we see the miracles because you couldn't have planned that journey. Like, if you've gone like when you were a kid and you're like, Oh, what do I want to be when I grow up? You never would have like strategized that journey. You wouldn't have you wouldn't have thought to choose it, but like when you look at it in the rearview mirror, you're like, Wow, all of those things were happening for me.

SPEAKER_03 12:02

All of those things are like, please, sexual predator, come cut up my underwear. No, I would not have done that, I would not have designed it that way.

SPEAKER_04 12:09

No, and I mean, of course, we don't want like sometimes things happen in our lives and we manifest things in our lives that we don't want that end up being a stepping stone to have us move into something that we do. And I love what you said about self-trust. It's like that confidence, that knowing. And I and I, you know, it's like you've got look at your life or anyone listening to this conversation right now, you've got a hundred percent track record of making it work.

SPEAKER_03 12:34

Well, yeah, that's right. I've never ended up in a ditch. So like I had what I realized is there's this fear. Like, what's my actual fear? What am I really afraid is gonna happen? And I was like, the fear was that I would end up in a ditch. Like for some reason, that was somehow stored in my brain, maybe from a past life, maybe from a movie I watched, who knows? Um, but that was the fear. And then when I saw that fear, I was like, I don't really think I'm gonna end up in a ditch. I might struggle, I might get scared. Some things I do, I might fail at some things that I do, and of course I did. Uh, but like, I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna let myself, I have everything I need to not end up in a ditch. Like I'm very clear about that, right? I could, I could end up in a ditch, I could cause that, but I was very clear that I wouldn't and that I had a choice. Uh, and that power of choice, I also believe is a big part of self-trust too. When you get like I can choose to F around, it's like like your listeners are mostly entrepreneurs, right? Like we can choose to F around, we can choose to spend two weeks on what color to pick for our website and get and and and bring in no business. Like we can choose that, or we can do what makes a difference. We can make decisions quickly, we can, you know, we can make a mistake and learn from that mistake fast more quickly, right?

SPEAKER_04 13:50

So, yeah, that idea of like failing forward, right? Like and I mean, this is like it doesn't have to be perfect. That's all right. And I think that that's it's interesting. Like for me, of like so. I'm I'm I have the benefit right now and like working on a contract because one of my old clients really needed help with something, and I typically wouldn't take a full-time job on, but you know, I was like, I really it was work that it was meaningful and it's in healthcare, and I get to be a contribution, and I was like, okay, you know what, I'll do this for a few months. But it's been what's been the blessing in it is I've seen the contrast between like how I show up as a project manager in this like corporate environment and how I be as a project manager or manager of my business. And I'm like, how is it that I can like be out here like delegating, you know, $90 million project? I don't do the majority of the work, I got no problem holding people to account and moving barriers and getting things done. But yet, when it's like Amber Howard and Associates, I am the business of one and I don't know how to build a team and I'm like a solo entrepreneur trying to do everything on my own. And it's like that, you know, beyond the work that we're doing in the projects, which are meaningful and we're building like a beautiful long-term care home for people, like all of that is great. But for me individually, like the lesson coming out of this is like, wow, like yeah, I show up differently. There's some different conversation that I am in my own business versus how I be in this corporate environment. And and then, like, then the opportunity is to like look at that and say, okay, well, why? Yeah, what is it about? You know, I've got I've got people who want to help me and I'm not leveraging them. What's that about? Like, why is it? And then it's like, oh, well, because these people are paid and and they're trained and they it's their job. So I have no problem delegating to people whose job it is, but these people don't know how to do the things I need them to do. And so I make it like this, like for me anyway, it's like, oh, it's hard. That's my default. That's kind of like I got to keep being responsible for it. Doesn't necessarily disappear. I get you. I have the opportunity to keep being responsible for the way I wound up in life is that life is hard and everything's hard, and and then I make it hard, right?

SPEAKER_03 15:57

Oh, I know that's such a common one, right? Also, that you know, there is that that human condition that we make other people matter. Yes, and we make what other people are we make what we're up to matter in uh when more this is just a human brain thing, right? Up or human condition thing. We make what we're uh so it's not so there is I could simplify and say, well, what we need to do is to make what we are what we're up to matter, and and yeah, that's part of the mindset is like getting hyper connected to like the difference, say, like, you know, Amber's company is making, like, you know, that's would be part of the work. But then the other thing is to deal, we just have to deal with ourselves about it. That like part of it is like other people seeing us be that what we're up to matters. So, how do we shift? Right, it becomes that inquiry. I think that's what this is what you're underlining is that inquiry of how do I get connected, how do I practice being that I care about what how I am in when in that what I'm up to matters, right? That my eyes on me matter, right? Not just other people's eyes on me. Other people's, it's a brilliant. I love that part of the human condition because it allows us to see ourselves when we um rise to the occasion in front of other people. Then we're like, oh, that's that that means that's in me. It's in me to do. I value that. And then we pretend like it's not there when only we can see it, right? It's like I used I used to um, I was just sharing with this with my clients yesterday. When I uh years ago, I was living with um downtown Toronto with my best friend Ben, and he was this like super skinny guy. And I and I'm you know, I'm I'm a little meatier, and I always worried that he was anytime I ate, he's like my bestie, he did not care what I looked like. Um, but I would worry that what what I looked like, no, what anytime he'd see me eat something unhealthy that he'd be thinking, oh well, that's why she's fat or something like that. That's what's going on in my brain. And so I would sneak, literally at night, I would sneak into the cup into the kitchen and try so quietly to get a cookie because I didn't want him having this thought, which maybe he had, maybe he didn't, but who cares? I'm still eating the cookie. The actual reality of the impact, I and I I'm all for cookies, by the way. This is not an anti-cookie podcast, but um, but you know what I mean? It's like we somehow trick ourselves into thinking it doesn't count if nobody sees, right?

SPEAKER_04 18:30

I love that. And it's so true. It and like it's so funny how we walk through life, like like we're so important. And it's not like we're not special and important, but that other people would be thinking those things about us, you know, like that that's what's consuming our mind. And they're probably walking around with similar thoughts about something completely like different, right? But it's like it when you can really get that, and uh it's interesting because I started a course wisdom recently and Jay. I know you've done and I'm I have, yeah, I'm in a uh kind of a course in the same area called Inquiry Exploration, which is like incredible, and they have this ongoing inquiry into your public persona, and this idea that you don't actually in fact own your public persona, like who you are in the public is actually how other people listen to you and how they perceive you, and it's not like, and so I'm I'm I'm really enjoying kind of playing in that a while. Like it's like, well, this this individual, this person that I think Amber is in the world, like there's who I am for myself and all of those conversations that I am for myself, and then there's also but there's also this huge like who do who am I for other people? Who do other people listen to me as? And then then the gap between who I am for myself or the constraining nature of those two things, right? How does how I see myself constrained, how I show up in the world, and how does like how I let other people listen to me at times? You know, it's just like it's fun to play in that. I think that's one of the big things.

SPEAKER_03 20:03

Forgetting that both matter.

SPEAKER_04 20:05

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 20:06

It matters, it does matter how we're viewed by others, and it does matter how you view yourself, and none are the ultimate truth, but both are perceptions, our perceptions. Yeah. So it's not that either it's like we could be like both. Um, you know, I know some people um where it's like both are so significant. I'm so worried about how I view myself, and I'm so worried about how the people think me. Like we could get really, we could get really stressed out about that, and you can drive yourself mad about that too. Um, you know, but yeah, when we when we decide to just own it for better, for worse, then we choose, okay, well, what do I want to adjust? What you know, what do I want to adjust to? Sorry, mute button. There's some things that uh see this little hand that keeps coming up here. It's some it just pushed the mute button. And then there's some things that I know people don't like about me, and but I'm but I'm like really good about it. So then my job is um is to give them the opportunity to understand why I'm good about that, and then they and then they choose, right? Like not every client's for me. Oh my gosh, we could get so lost and trying to have every person want to be our clients or every person want to be like agree with us. Like that's you lose yourself in that too. It's not a great way to find love either, by the way, when we're trying to be everything for everybody, but yeah, I definitely have gone through that phase in my life for sure.

SPEAKER_04 21:36

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So speaking of love, you talk about power love. It's kind of like you talk about power love everywhere. It's kind of I know, I know.

SPEAKER_03 21:45

It's kind of taking a life of its own, right? Um, what is power love? Yeah, so power love, so initially, initially power love got created. So what I love, so I worked at Landmark for a number of years, as you know. Um and uh when I when I left The company and start deciding to start my own coaching business. Um, it was I was advised to choose a particular problem to solve, and I was like, How do I choose? I don't know where to start. And they're like, just as a place to start, you don't have to do it like that forever, but just a place to start and get you know, get really freaking good at it. And she said, Well, choose your favorite transformation. Well, my most recent favorite, unexpected, blow-my-mind transformation was the area of finding love, but not just any love. I've been in relationships before, the like the one I wanted to create my, you know, create my life with, the kind of relationship where I got to be all of me, where we got to co-create a life, co-create a family, not live about keeping up with the Joneses or any of that crap that I just don't not into. Um, you know, really like a a co-creator. And um, and that was, and I did, right? As you know, uh in my journey, that was that was something that that I created in my life and like in a freaking transformation because my life was not like that before. Anyhow, so I was like, okay, that's the area I'm focusing on. And so as I started, you know, taking my my psychology, my personal development work, my personal experience when I'd done that pro, but like did my own project for myself uh and was designing this program. I realized that what I was most passionate about was that we have these, well, I guess a couple things. So one was noticing how many women, including myself, lose power in the presence of love. We lose our personal power, particularly women, right? Where love turns into losing ourselves, where love turns into uh over-accommodating, where love turns into needing to be like like desperately needing to feel loved. Like all of these, it turns into validation. It turns into all of these things that nobody really wants it to turn into. And and yet here, you know, here it was. And you know, we turn into that that girl that's like dying for him to text back and reading so far into it when he doesn't, or he says just a one-word answer, and we're like, oh my god, he answered with the letter K. It's there's this is that, you know, right? What did I say? I don't know anything about that either, Michelle. Right. Um, and and I just became really committed that that women get to experience whatever, whether they want to, if they want to be single, they they get to be single, but be be empowered when you're when you're feeling when you're single. And you can be empowered if you're single and want to be single, and you can be empowered if you're single and want to be in love. And that is another space where we often lose power, where it's like someone asks, I remember someone would ask me, like, oh, why are you still single? Which is like felt like a sneaky way of saying, What's wrong with you? And whether they meant it or not, that's how I heard it, that's how I felt it. And I was like, Oh, it was just such an I had to justify it to pretend that I didn't really want to be in it in order to feel like I had this sense of power. Well, no, we can want things, we can go after things, just like we go after businesses that we want and we don't have it yet. It's like, yeah, well that's like the journey, right? Like that's like a big, significant, awesome part of it. So power love is merging the the the empowered part of ourselves with the part of ourselves that wants to love, that wants to give, that wants to be loved, that's soft, gentle, nurturing, wonderful part of ourselves with the badass, kick-ass, unstoppable part of ourselves. And whether that started with the work that I was doing, that I still do, that I still do, and but initially was the only thing that I focused on uh helping women in their journey of finding love. Uh, and then had then as I started working with more and more people, or they continue to work with me after that initial part of the program, we realized, oh my gosh, no, power love is for everything everywhere. Like I need power love as a coach. Um, you know, we you know, we need power love just in our in our relationship with ourselves, in how we choose who who we bring into in our friendships, in our relationships with our parents. And what is it, honey? Oh, you want to still stay on my lap? Okay, honey. Um, in our parenting, right? Oh, you what do you want to say, Izzy? Say you want to say something? That's the microphone. Good morning, Izzy.

SPEAKER_04 26:29

Say hi, Amber.

SPEAKER_01 26:31

Hi, Amber.

SPEAKER_04 26:32

Hi, thank you for being on the show with mommy and I.

SPEAKER_03 26:37

You're welcome. You're welcome.

SPEAKER_04 26:42

Yeah, back to what you were saying a couple minutes, like a couple minutes ago, Michelle. Like, I am almost afraid when I'm meeting men to tell them how long I've been single. Yeah. Because I've been like, I haven't been in a committed relationship for 12 years.

SPEAKER_01 26:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 26:54

And and it's like jaw dropping, like for them. It's like, and it's never said. Or I often get the like, why are you, you know, that's the same thing. Why are you single? Like, you're too great to be single. And and that implication of like, well, what is wrong with you?

SPEAKER_03 27:11

That's well, even that, yeah. Like you're too, oh, you're too. Oh, hang on, Izzy. Just hang on, sweetheart, please stop. There we go. Um, even the you're you're too great to being single. I will get that too, but you're but you're this, but you're that. And then it feels like, oh, must be something you don't know of, like it's still inside of this realm of something's wrong with you, right? Um, and and same sort of thing. Like, yeah, it's I I completely understand. It's basically that feeling, that feeling it stops us from actually taking any action. I was just talking about it's funny. Um, so a client of mine is she's more working on her social life right now with me and her career, it's her overall. We kind of do general like life empowerment coaching. And um, and one of the things that she realized, like she doesn't really do many social things. So here we are, we are looking at her social life. We are uh, and she like wants to go, doesn't want to go. And one of the things that she's discovering is oh, when people say, Oh, don't go, don't go, or oh, stay longer, or like you know, all of this stuff, like it was riddled with guilt for her. It made her not want to go at all. Because the only way to have it work in her life was is if she doesn't stay for six hours or whatever it is. And as you know, you and I know Amber, the bigger your life becomes, the less able you're able to do anything for six hours, you know. But when we were 20, sure, yeah, I could go and spend like a whole evening and then just whatever, make it what like what was I really doing the next day? You know, it was all fine. So, um, and so, but same with finding love where we get, we're like, I don't want to put myself in this position. So much of I don't want to put myself in a position where I have to explain myself or where I feel like crap because they ask me a certain question, or I don't want to put myself in a position where um uh where he likes what if he likes me more than I like him, and then I have to let him down. That is just as scary for women, whether they admit it or not, it's just as scary for us as being rejected. Reject, in fact, I think it's actually feels worse for us to reject because we're so empathetic. We can feel, we're so afraid of like how they're gonna feel, right? Even more than we're worried about how we're gonna feel.

SPEAKER_04 29:34

I'm like on this contract, and I'm having to let vendors know that they didn't get chosen for uh like a procurement. And I'm like, I find myself not wanting to send the emails. And you know, I could like, you know, I and it was so funny when you were talking earlier. I was reminded like that whole like who we are for ourselves versus how the world views us. I was reminded of a conversation with a mutual friend of ours, Faith, at one point when I was in the Introduction Leaders program that you were coaching. And um, I had gotten nasty with her because I had it like she wanted me to hang the phone up on one of my friends, and I was like, What is wrong with you? And my like, my like a fierce part of me came out that she'd never seen. And so when I was cleaning up with her, she was like, She goes, You know, some people are nice, Amber, and it's authentic for them to be nice. She goes, but you're not nice authentically, are you? She goes, You're something else that I can't say, but you can say what you are, right? And I was like, I feel like you're wanting me to say I'm a fierce B like B-I-T-C-H. She goes, You really are, aren't you? But it's like that, but she owns it. She is too, but she owns it. She does own it. And and what I got in that conversation with her, which was so great, is like I kept that part of myself under lock and key because I was afraid it would hurt people.

unknown 30:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 30:46

And she was like, Well, that's because when she finally escapes Amber, she goes like she just like goes ravaged. She goes, be in the world expressed. Yeah, because that's your natural self-expression, it wouldn't be a problem, right? And I like the fact that I'm I'm empathetic and that I care about people. So it's like, you know, you don't have to throw the proverbial baby out with a bath bottle, right? Like I get to be all of it.

SPEAKER_03 31:12

Yeah, very good. That's power love too. Because without power love, we swing from one extreme to the other. When we get, when we make power love one thing, we can we navigate, and there is no, yeah. Like sometimes you are gonna hurt somebody, somebody's feelings, and so am I. And then we clean it up. Um, you know, we then it ends up being a more connected relationship than it's ever been because it's an honest relationship. Like, how cool is that? Rather than all this, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice. And then boom, you know, we're not nice anymore. And because something happens, and then we've been, it's almost like whether we know it or not, we're always holding it over people's heads how nice we were. Those of us that have that little straw that's playing that, too. I've been working so hard to be nice to you and you don't return my call. How dare you, you know, or you have a true opinion, or you don't accommodate me or whatever, right? And it's we don't know we do it until you start really observing, which I'm sure you have, right?

SPEAKER_04 32:09

Oh, yeah. No, the martyr that I mean my kids know it very well. I always say, like, if you know, for anyone who knows me, and I am lovely and I am great, and I can be a real jerk. And if you really want to get an honest estimation of who I am in the world, talk to my children because they see all of it and they love me and they adore me and they think I'm incredible and an inspiration and all of this stuff, but they also know that I can be a first class a-hole, like I could just be such a jerk. And for me, the way that shows up is in the martyr. Like, it's like, what more do you want from me? Like the minute someone I've got my day planned and I've got how things are gonna go. And I my kids are older, right? So I'm very used to like having a pretty high degree of control over how my day is gonna go. And the minute someone comes to ask me something that's not on my to-do list today, I'm like, like the guy literally like twitch.

unknown 32:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 32:57

And I've learned to be responsible for it. In the past, I would just be like, really, like, you know, kind of send people away with my energy around it. Now I can like, I know, I know like this is why the self-development is so important because you know that I know that's coming. The minute someone asks me something that I'm not prepared for, I know to expect the martyr's gonna show up.

SPEAKER_03 33:17

Totally, totally. And I think, you know, part of it too, or how I how I manage that anyway with myself is um is knowing myself before I reach that point. So I bring the bitch a little earlier so that I can, so that I have my I still have my hands on the wheel. You know, when it's created, when and I'm saying bitch very loosely, okay. Um uh, but just you know, that's that's where creating boundaries is. That's where saying no before, because what we have, what we do, and this is where you may have seen some of my stuff. I don't know, talking about the super, the superwoman vicious cycle, right? Where we give, we give, we do, we do, and entrepreneurs out there, especially women, oh my God, and especially if you're a mom too, like it's you're gonna, and all of us can relate to this, is you give, you give, you push, you push, you push, you push, because you can. You say yes to things because you have a bit of room. Yes, yes, absolutely, yes, yes, yes. And then until the breaking point, and there's always a breaking point, there's always a crash, and then we fall into powerless woman. Because then when that happens, whether we get sick or we make a really big mess, like it's a like a real crash into something, um, or there's an accident or something, then all of a sudden, woe is me. I don't who am I to think I could have accomplished everything? People around me don't respect me. Um, I don't respect me, and we have to go through this wham-wham period until enough time passes that the water is not overflowing and it just there's a little bit of clearance bull in the forehead, and then we're like, oh, I have room. I have room. So I'm gonna say yes to everything, I'm gonna push myself everything, yeah, you know, and then this cycle continues, right? But if we can actually, you know, like the you know, like the work you and I do, Amber, which is like observing of the self, getting to know the self, mastering the self so that we can start saying, you know what, I see where that's going. Yeah, that's gonna lead to right now. It feels good, that's gonna lead to resentment, burnout, crash, something. So I'm so no, I'm not gonna do that. We can come, we can come up with another way that you get the help you need, but it's not gonna be through me doing that, right? Um, and and that's tricky. That's tricky for us women because we could say yes.

SPEAKER_04 35:41

Well, and and the the you know, people to I remember once having this conversation with a mutual friend of ours, Ellen, and she's like, Amber, people love your identity, you get stuff done. They're you gotta be responsible for saying no. They're always gonna come to you because you get stuff done and you're a yes. So why would they go to someone who they're gonna have to enroll in something? You're always enrolled, right? And I got like I got to be responsible for that. And and when I left myself, when I left my journey to be a landmark forum leader, I got like anytime I do things inside of a should, which for most of my life was how I operated, like, oh, I should say yes, I should do this. I, you know, like I'm I want to be a good person, like whatever that is. All that's available for me are like variations of my fixed ways of being. So, like I'm gonna say yes to something, even if I don't want to do it because I'm being nice, and then I'm gonna be driven to accomplish it because I gave my word to it, but at the same time, I'm gonna be rebellious about it and cut myself off at the knees. And it's like some variation, yeah, and it's misery for me. And it's I don't get to show.

SPEAKER_03 36:45

Sorry.

SPEAKER_04 36:46

Sorry?

SPEAKER_03 36:46

No, no, no. I was gonna say it's gonna be the parts, just interject. The parts that nobody can see are gonna be the parts. This just ties it into what we were saying earlier, right? The parts nobody can see is where you're cutting yourself at the knees, yeah. Right. And your self-care or whatever it is 100%.

SPEAKER_04 37:01

And I remember once, like when I, you know, when I was competing with people about leaving Lamarck and having conversations with people to like, because I I I I got like I had a commitment in the community and people are works, you know.

SPEAKER_03 37:13

Oh, I hear you, honey.

SPEAKER_04 37:14

Yeah, yeah, I had those conversations, I'm sure you did too. Uh for for you in that time. Like people saying, like, I always looked at you and I was like, I don't know how she does it all. Like, I have no, like, how are you at the center three, four times a week, and you're a mom, and you've got like working, and and it's like, well, I wasn't sleeping and I wasn't eating properly and I wasn't taking care of myself. And when you're when you're an inspirational figure, like people used to say, Oh, you know, you're intimidating. And I was like, I don't know, like I always took intimidating to mean like threatening, and I was like, I'm not, I wouldn't hurt a fly. But someone said to me, No, Amber, they don't mean intimidating in terms of threatening, they mean intimidating in terms of like Mount Everest is intimidating, like I could never be that. And I got how how inauthentic it is when you're out to lead, and it's it's like it's not all working, and it's a facade that it is all working. So then you become this like this gap for people that's fake because your life isn't all working, and my life wasn't all working, and I'm still, yeah, you know, like a year and a half in, that was like June of 2020. I'm still learning like when to like take space for myself and give myself time to rest and and and all of that stuff. I don't even like I'm not sitting here today like I've got anything handled about that because I know, like, as you know, in an instant, yeah, I can go, it can like it can swing totally back the other way, where I'm like giving way too much of myself. And it's almost like a daily checking in with self, like even sometimes moment by moment, man, I'm feeling really drained. And like, what do I what can I what can I put in now versus like in the past, it would have been like you know, like to the point where I I just I mean, the only time I ever stopped was when I was hospitalized.

SPEAKER_03 38:57

There it is. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's so good that you're doing the checking in now. And I have to do the same thing. It was a whole new, and you can appreciate this because you've been a mom for a long time. For me, it was such a game changer in a not good way when I became a mom. I like I had done all these years of of of inner of self-work and self-development work and create these amazing, like, you know, and I my morning routines, I've always I'm a huge advocate of it's it's okay for it to shift and change. It doesn't have to be the morning miracle, only one way every, you know, every day for the rest of your life that you can adjust it. But I had like a routine to always have a routine in place, um, you know, my my mindset mastery, all of that. And then then I had a baby, which I chose, I created, but you know, you take a woman's sleep away and you take her freedom. I hate to say it that way. Now it's a bit better. She's older, but no, but no, it's true. I think it's like you are completely dependent on. And it became actually, it started for me discovering when even when I was pregnant, when I got reached about six, six, seven months pregnant, I was like, whoa, my the the work that I would do to be fully on, you know, to be able to fully show up for people, to be able to come live and be a hundred percent alert. Like that only lasted maybe an hour after I did my my my stuff, right? And then I was like, and then I was back to being cloudy and all over the place. And I wasn't, I didn't even have my baby yet. I was just pregnant. And I was like, oh geez. And so, you know, I think part of it too is is what that we recognize that our life happens in seasons and what we need, just what we need to feel great, as you know, it changes and how great we're gonna feel for a little bit can change. Like I've I started, I got resentful when in the first few months of being a mom because I really missed feeling the way I did before for lots of hours of the day. And the struggle was from the resisting of it, more most of the struggle. There's the struggle, it's just the struggle, but like resisting it. And then it felt like I had this choice. It felt like I either need to, because someone kept saying to me, just surrender, Michelle, just surrender. And I was like, But I don't want to surrender, like give up. I don't want to surrender, like in that kind of surrender. And it felt like it was either just give into it and become a lump on the couch and nurse for the next gazillion months, and then maybe one day people are like, Don't worry, once she goes to school, I'm like, When she goes to school, that's years from now. What are you talking about? That's not helpful. It's not helpful right now. And um, and I read this amazing book. This is great for I think you you would love this, and probably lots of your listeners, especially female entrepreneurs. It's a book by Denise Duffield Thomas called Chillpreneur. Super cheesy title. She would be the first to say it. Um, she's also so she's a money mindset coach. Um, but she so she's written books like Get Rich, Lucky Bitch, also a really great book. But Chilpreneur is her response to the over masculine, overcomplicating of business that we've kind of stepped into. But we're in a new age now, and business can be very easy if we want it. It's not easy like it doesn't take anything, but in comparison to you know, when we were kids.

SPEAKER_04 42:19

Um, and yeah, I was gonna say, I definitely will check out that book. I love it. I um, and it's like I I hear what you're saying about like a new space for because I work in business as well, right? So as more and more women slept into leadership, it's like we change the agreements around like why do we even have male and female leadership? Why is it not just a conversation about leadership?

SPEAKER_03 42:43

Totally.

SPEAKER_04 42:43

Well, yeah, but we know back to what you were yeah, well, now is that we could have another podcast episode just about that topic. But when you're talking about the train, like and my heart goes out to especially like I had children before I knew any better, right? Like that's what I say to people. I was 16 when I got pregnant with Matthew. I had two kids and I was by 18.

SPEAKER_01 43:02

Bless you.

SPEAKER_04 43:02

So, and what's been interesting for me is kind of the flip side of that as I'm going through wisdom and like defining what adult is as a possibility. I'm like, I have adult and mom collapsed. I was a mom before I was an adult, so like my whole life has been so like the view through which I make decisions has always been my kids. So now that I they're 25 and 24 and 15, and I'm like looking at creating what's next for my life, like like looking at stepping out of but for so many women who have children later in life, you've had decades of like living your life, going to dinner when you want, being out in life, like all of this time has been spent living. So it is a huge transition. And I don't think we as more and more women are having children. I mean, I know I wasn't quite the norm these days, back in the day, I would have been the norm, but you know, like as more and more women choose, and and people, not just women, but women and men choose to have families later in life. Yeah, um I think that needs to be part of the conversation. Is a very different transition when you're in your 30s and you spent the first three decades of your life, you know, or two and a half decades of your life, whatever, doing whatever you wanted whenever you wanted it.

SPEAKER_01 44:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 44:11

Now you've got this child, and and it is, it's you know, it's not well, and it's yeah, and it's why, and this is why I loved the book Showpreneur, and why I'll always have coaches. I always have a coach, at least one. Usually I have like three coaches. And as a coach, I think it's important that we have coaches. Otherwise, what are we doing? Right. 100%. But um, but but for that reason, that like we're all I think what happened, we're just so inundated with marketing messaging, which, as we all know, marketing, most marketing is based on what's the pain point and how can I convince you that with this solution, you won't feel that pain anymore. And so we are, whether we know it or not, and we're like constantly being inundated with this, and especially entrepreneurs, because there is a huge market for for business coaching or anything related to business coaching, right? We're inundating with all these messages, and it puts us anytime we see a marketing message, whether it's about what we should look like or what our business should look like or how we should feel. I think what happens is we we collapse it into this snapshot of how we should be. And unfortunately, I well, no, I think fortunately, we are all complex, we are all different, we have lots of commonalities, but we are all unique in our own way. And there's some really beautiful things to be created with that, but not if we're trying to fit some snapshot image that we don't even know that we put in our brains, we don't even because it happens so fast or so many times so quickly, right? You know, um, it's like, and that, and that's what I think the gift of coaching, particularly any like one well, one-to-one or group, but where you get actual engagement with, you know, with with the coach, with your development, where we get to, and this is what I love about it, where we get to really explore, but wait, where am I where am I right now? And what are all the complexities of what of what of what I deal with and what what do I act what do I actually want? And how do we how do we get there? Right? Because it's not a it's not gonna be a formula, it's not gonna be a blueprint, like because then that would mean, you know, I mean depends on what the blueprint is, but you know what I'm saying? Like we're just and it's such a cool inquiry, but only only inside of the context of I am, I I yeah, we all deal with the human condition, but we're all in different stages and different different journeys and different and we have different desires, right? Having it all success to each of us is different.

SPEAKER_04 46:45

Well, and as as I I a hundred percent agree with you, and I think I get really frustrated to be honest, because I mean it's just natural, we're comparing ourselves, right? We cannot like it, you know, we can deny it or we can try and resist it, but like I think it's easier when you just say, okay, that's part of it. Like when I'm out there on social media and I'm seeing because the minute you start defining yourself some way, all of a sudden the advertising machine goes into effect, and all you see is other people's content. Part of you own you, you you also manifesting that for yourself, that so that because the more you attract something to yourself, the more it shows up around you. And you know, as a business strategist and someone who's worked in corporations for decades, it's like a business is not just a lead generation strategy. A business is not just your marketing, right? Like that may be like, yeah, maybe the first thing to start to tend to is how do I get revenue in the door and how do I start serving people? But like, what's my plan for the future? How am I going to scale this? How do I start to build a team? What are the other processes that you know what like what are my other products? What how do I, okay, I've served people with this one thing, I've got this one offer, but what's the journey that like I'm am I creating one-time clients or do I want to create clients for life? And what's the kind of relationship I want to have with my customers? Like all of these things go into it beyond my staff and my team, right? Absolutely. How do I, what's the future going to look like? And do I have goals that are propelling me forward? Not just like a revenue goal for the next six months, but like what's my long-term vision for this? You know, not like some kind of constraint that I get attached to, like a vision, like what is the purpose of what I'm creating? And how does the activities of this, the day-to-day activities that I'm taking on my journey, the process serve that vision, right? Like there's so many different aspects. And I think it it gets kind of simplified down to this, like, oh, you know, what's your like how are you getting clients in the door? Like, how are you marketing yourself? What's your one problem that you solve? Well, I think I think having a business is is way more than that. And I and I think oftentimes that gets missed in the conversation. So I think, and you know, I'm gonna have to have you back on the show because this is just what's gonna happen, probably more than once, because I love talking to you and there's so much we could talk about. Uh, but you know, for anyone who has loved being with Izzy and Michelle this morning, and I think I'm actually gonna put Michelle and Izzy in the title for the podcast, that just seems appropriate. Um, and you know, Michelle, just thank you for being here. You'll be able to find out about Michelle and everything she's up to, where you can get her book, how you can reach out to her and connect and and see if you you would be a fit, whether it's you're looking for love or your take on your leadership, any of the women out there who really want to take their level life to the next level. Michelle is definitely someone who can really powerfully support you in doing that. So, Michelle, I love you so much. Thank you for who you are in my life, who you are for people, and just thank you for being on the show this morning.

SPEAKER_03 49:37

Uh, thank you for having me and for your grace with the with the circumstances of a little three-year-old with us. So and thank you, less of people listening. You're awesome for making it making your way through here and just for everything you're up to. So, yeah, I appreciate being here.

SPEAKER_04 49:52

And I'd love to have it any other way. Sorry, go ahead. I said I'd love to come back, absolutely. Amazing. All right, have a great weekend, everyone. Thank you for listening.

SPEAKER_00 50:01

Thank you so much for joining us for this week's episode. For show info, visit what would Amber Do.com. And for information about Amber Howard and Associates' offerings and services, visit amberhowardinc.com.